Number 25 Early Trigger assembly Question |
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jackdog
Red Ryder Member Joined: June-01-2016 Location: Cape may, NJ Points: 428 |
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Posted: August-01-2020 at 5:08pm |
Have a customer who works on 25's and got a very early one with the two piece trigger. It had the flat wire compression spring in it but one leg was broken off , so it did not work. So several weeks later he got a spring from me but now he can not remember how the sear and trigger go together. Anyone have information on this assembly.
Here is a pic I stole from Jay (Gumslinger) fro m a previous post.. that is the trigger assembly I am referring to. The next question is will the newer version of the 25 trigger spring work in this trigger assembly once it is back in the gun? I have no experience with this early trigger assembly so I can't help him. But would appreciate any comments or help here. Thanks. Rick |
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Gumslinger
Red Ryder Member Joined: March-20-2019 Location: North Florida Points: 400 |
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Oh boy, I wish your buddy had taken pics of his disassembly before it was loose parts. I've learned to do that the hard way--really has saved my butt in the past. As far as his particular spring, I have never seen a schematic, description, or explanation of how this trigger is assembled. And believe me, I have looked. (We need a retired Daisy gunsmith on this forum).
These pics are from a work in progress. A first variant, 1914, maybe a prototype. Trigger was loose & floppy. Upon opening, there was no flat-wire spring as I was expecting, BUT there was a coil spring (bent aside) and a rotating wire in a slot. (sheesh--only seen that in a No 25 patent). For what it is worth in this case, these are the pics of that disassembly. For all I know there was supposed to be a flat spring in there as well. PS. If your buddy can reinstall his spring, please, please have him post the results here. Thanks. |
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jackdog
Red Ryder Member Joined: June-01-2016 Location: Cape may, NJ Points: 428 |
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Jay I had a hunch you would have some info on this trigger... As I looked at it when he asked me some questions I began to realize this is an oddball. i mean its not all that easy to figure out unless you saw one put together. Never saw a 25 with a coil spring in the stock nor any wire in a slot!! Holy cow I think yours is really baffling to me! He did say his had a broken flat wire compression spring in it. But made no mention of a coil or wire.. I am going to send him this post and hope he can shed some more light on this. I'm intrigued...
Thanks Jay as always... Rick
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GRM
Newbie Joined: August-02-2020 Location: Texas Points: 6 |
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Good afternoon!
I just now joined the forum so we can discuss my issue with the trigger arrangement. Thanks to everyone involved, so far. My gun had a coil spring also. Unfortunately it simply fell out with the trigger parts as I removed the pivot bolt. I will post pictures and comments as time permits. GR
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jackdog
Red Ryder Member Joined: June-01-2016 Location: Cape may, NJ Points: 428 |
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Jerry Welcome to the forum, and glad you could add some comments about your 25 trigger..
Posting Photos is somewhat involved , but I would be glad to put any up for you if you email them to me... Regards, rick
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Gumslinger
Red Ryder Member Joined: March-20-2019 Location: North Florida Points: 400 |
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Since
there is no published information on replacing an early No. 25 trigger spring,
I can only suggest these photos as a guide. The very early triggers have a
rear-most pivot point. The next generation triggers have a front pivot point,
and the ‘paperclip’ spring inserts as shown in the sketch. So does this mean
the flat-wire spring inserts pointing in the opposite direction? The
long leg on the 2nd generation spring holds the safety bar down, so
I presume the long leg on the flat-wire spring must do the same, in whichever
orientation it is installed. |
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Gumslinger
Red Ryder Member Joined: March-20-2019 Location: North Florida Points: 400 |
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Just for archival purposes, I am going to post the trigger pictures of the No. 25 Variant 1, screw-in-the-receiver (which holds the safe bar in place) in this thread. This gun is an oddball, trigger-wise, and I will follow up on the exploration as I continue--especially if I learn anything about the rotating wire thing…PS--this gun had been opened in the past, so I cannot state that anything might be missing, or switched, or…who knows. The trigger spring itself is: --9/64” ID --7/32---13/64” OD --1 7/16” long |
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stevec
Red Ryder Member Joined: September-22-2003 Points: 1464 |
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Wonder if there is something in Gary Garber's book about this
Stevec
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jackdog
Red Ryder Member Joined: June-01-2016 Location: Cape may, NJ Points: 428 |
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Jay you are blowing my mind with these posts... I see what the coil spring does, puts tension on the sear... but nothing in the patent drawings show anything putting tension on the safe bar.. so what does the leaf spring do? put tension on just the trigger? I am sorry just do not get it. I think if I had one of these guns maybe I could make sense out of it. Also what is that wire thing shown going under the trigger screw????? I am confused..
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Gumslinger
Red Ryder Member Joined: March-20-2019 Location: North Florida Points: 400 |
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I don't know where I read it, but it was specific to early gun patents, and it went like this: "Patents are very, very broad when presented for approval. In the meanwhile, the production department was left to adapt the design to reality. Reality meant on-the-fly changes, experiments, prototypes, goofs, cost trade-offs, management disputes, designer tirades, heavy drinking, and eventually the product hit the sales floor.
So, that leaves us to ponder what the original configuration was meant to be. That is why I post all these pictures--hoping for input, or to give others that 'AHA moment!' that they can share here. |
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